I think it's a good thing. I think it's me Kristen. And today in the unladies I have an uncut gem from all the way back in 2019.

That was when I interviewed Cave Diver and undersea explorer Jill Hineerth, all about how she became a cave diver, and her memoir

into the planet My Life as a cave diver. The thing for this interview that I still think about is the way that

Jill talks about fear because what she does requires her to truly do the illogical,

send her body into spaces that the human body was really not meant to exist in and more recently what got me thinking

about Jill in this conversation is the movie Nyad. Have you all seen Nyad? I almost wasn't going to watch it. It's on

Netflix as of this recording and it's about the real life long distance swimmer

Diana Nyad and it's all about the real life story of her deciding that she is

going to swim from Cuba to Key West.

And she's in her 60s.

And y'all, it is lovely.

It stars Annette Benning as Diana Nyad and Jody Foster as her best friend

slash coach and it's yes this story of this incredible feat and also it's a gorgeous story of a long-term

lesbian best friendship but while Diane and I did absolutely do the impossible and make that swim,

Jill Heineer, yeah she does a lot of swimming, but she's going deep.

She's going deep and dark and if trouble occurs, it's not like you can swim right up to the surface and save yourself because then you'll get the bends.

So grab your snorkels on ladies, slip on your flippers,

and let's get into this uncut gem.

We have so much to talk about. Obviously we're going to be asking you about cave diving,

how you got into it, what it actually entails. And since this is on ladylike I definitely want to dig into gender and

and how all of that intersects but first could you just tell us your name, where you live, and what you do?

My name is Jill Hineerth. I live in Carleton Place, Canada, just south of Ottawa, and I am a cave explorer an underwater cave

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