Everyone, Ben, could be radio. Hope you're having an awesome day. Wherever you are, whatever

you're doing. Tom, welcome back to the show. Two in two weeks.

No, thanks, Ben. This is good. Yes, it's really good. How are you doing?

I'm all right. I'm absolutely beyond tired. The child is up in the night a lot at the moment

but you you amazingly learn how to cope and function. You just sort of have to.

I remember years ago when I used to do a lot of nutrition seminars back in the pre-COVID days,

there would always be those questions from an audience member. Like without fail, they basically

said, how do I get more energy? And then my second question to them would be, do you have kids?

And they're like, yeah. And I used to go through all this kind of narrative around sleep and

like caffeine and all the rest of it. And then now my parent, I'm like, it's just a certain amount.

You just sort of at the moment can't get back. You just sort of you don't really, you always feel

like you can never really get beyond 80%. Obviously, I hope that my children sleep really well

at some point. And I hear they do as you get older, but like in terms of optimizing human performance,

it was always a question I'd get as seminars. And I used to just sort of waffle my way for an

answer. And I suppose I would then probably say, I'll let you know when I get kids.

It's interesting, isn't it? Like because there are two sort of stories you could tell

from like an evolutionary perspective around that. It's like, is it the case that we evolved the

ability to just kind of deal with less sleep? Because at some point, it's an adult you're probably

going to have kids. And that's going to mean that you get less sleep. And so you adapt to it.

Or is it the case that you don't properly adapt to it? Because in like historical,

nomadic tribe times, the parents were the only ones raising the kids and the kids were raised by

the village. So the parents got some sleep. I'm not an anthropologist if anyone wanted to chime in

...