Hey everybody, this is Aubrey Chavez from Faith Matters. Today we're really excited to bring you a

conversation with Justin Dyer. He's a professor of religion at BYU and a researcher who has spent

years exploring the intersection of faith and mental health. Justin's most recent work focuses on

perfectionism, especially within the church, which is a topic that we are super interested in.

And he recently edited a brand new issue of BYU Studies Quarterly dedicated entirely to this subject.

You can find a link to that in our show notes.

It's totally free and we highly recommend it.

In this conversation, Justin shares some of his research, including the striking finding

that high levels of toxic perfectionism

triple the likelihood of leaving one's religion. And he offers some really profound insights into why this is the case.

And he talks about some gospel principles that could actually really help us to replace some of those unhealthy perfectionistic beliefs.

And one of Justin's key insights is how our perceptions become our physiological reality.

He explains that stress responses influence not only how we think, but our ability to connect

and to even feel the spirit.

And so this really underscores the vital importance of creating church communities that are

unconditionally loving and

judgment-free spaces where people can feel completely accepted. Justin highlights the critical

difference between guilt and shame, how one leads us toward growth and change while the other

erodes our sense of worth and connection to God. But maybe most importantly, he offers some really

practical and hopeful

steps for healing from perfectionism and embracing a view of self-worth that's firmly rooted

in God's infinite love. And he shares some ways that we can help our wards become places of

...