Welcome to In Conversation, the regular podcast of InCampus.

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This is Paul Adamson and I'm in conversation with Simon Anhold.

Simon is the author of a new book, The Good Country Equation,

and he's also an independent policy advisor and researcher who has worked with the leaders and

governments of more than 50 nations to help them improve their economic, political and

cultural engagement with the international community. I know, Simon, you've been advising

the governments and other kinds of organisations for many years in this area about global reputation and also giving many talks, especially TED Talks, which are also available on YouTube, and written many books on that.

And I was difficult to try to work out where your new book, the Good Country equation, is coming from.

It's almost like you want to kind of press reset on

your own thinking of mind, the thinking of globalization. And we'll start from maybe one of many

quotes I'll throw at you of your own words. You say at the beginning of the book, we've allowed

many parts of globalization to spiral out of control, and there are failures and responsibilities

that need to be acknowledged

before we can press reset. What do you mean by that? Give me some examples of these examples

of globalisation spiraling out of control. Gosh, you started with the hard one, didn't you?

Throughout my career, I've met people and had conversations with them about globalisation,

because that's the sort of background topic to everything I've ever done. And I find that you're

expected to either be a pro-globalist or an anti-globalist. And I suppose I've come to the conclusion

that neither position is tenable. Globalisation is just a thing. It's not an idea that somebody

invented one day and thought, this is a good plan, let's follow it. And it went wrong. Globalisation,

I often think, and I said this in the book, is more an instinct of human nature.

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