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Hi, you're listening to Podlitical, BBC Scotland's podcast

that brings you an inside look at the big stories coming out of Hollywood and Westminster.

It is about half-past eleven on Wednesday the 16th of October.

I am Phil Sim, a journalist based at the Scottish Parliament, and today I'm joined by...

Glenn Campbell, contributing today from East Lothian.

And David Porter from Westminster.

Now, obviously, it's recess at Hollywood.

It's also Wednesday, not our usual day, but you know,

you've read the episode title. You probably don't live under a rock. You know what's going

on. We thought we should get together to talk about the death of the former First Minister

Alex Salmon. So, you know, hopefully I've been joined by two colleagues who have spent

decades covering Alex Salmon's life and career.

Easy, easy. Thank you to both of you for joining. who have spent decades covering Alex Salmon's life and career.

Easy, easy. Thank you to both of you for joining.

So, I mean, I guess we do have to go back decades, don't we?

We sort of kick off with the history of Alex Salmon.

It goes way back before he was even an MP.

I mean, Glenn, do you want to get started with sort of looking back to Alex Salmon's early years in the independence movement?

Yeah, I mean, Alex Salmon has been a fixture in our politics for decades.

And interestingly, he both started and ended his political career as something of a rebel. So at the time of his

...