If any mind has some wisdom to offer in it, maybe it's yours.

Your books have sold over 45 million copies.

Historian, philosopher, and the best-selling author of Sapiens, please welcome Yuval Noah Harari.

What are humans for? As far as we know for nothing, human rights, just like God and heaven, are just a story that we've invented.

They are not an objective reality.

They are not some biological fact about Homo sapiens.

There is no great cosmic drama

that we have a role to play in it.

Dr. Mark Gaffney, we're here because I was listening to some of the things that Yuval Noah Harari was saying in his speeches, was writing in his books, and it had

a chilling effect on my body. It felt like, well, in some regard, he's making a lot of sense,

but some of the things he's saying about life not having meaning, everything being a contrivance,

a fiction, a story, it didn't feel quite right. And then we started talking and you said,

no, actually, it's not quite right. And you started to lay it out.

And so what we're doing here today is we're going through what he's actually saying.

And then your actual response to that, which has been a truly revivifying experience for me where I feel like,

I can breathe again. Totally. Well, first, I just love when you say revivifying.

Just I feel revivified and I feel perspicacious, indefatigable, and just just enchanted.

So it's so good to see you, man.

Yeah.

Right. Yeah. And we have laid it out here, right, a little bit.

And I just want to say just there's rare conversations where you're saying like,

wow, this really matters to get this right. And I want to really want to get this right. And I want to

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