Welcome to the rest of his politics leading with me, Rory Stewart, and we're going to go

now back into a detailed discussion on Brexit and for this is just very quickly because

it now seems distant history. UK voted to leave in 2016 and Theresa May then came in as

Prime Minister, did these negotiations, people will remember vague the I guess phrases

like the checkers agreement with draw agreement. The backstop. Backstop, yes, through

a negotiation with Michel Vagnie at the end of 2018 produced her withdrawal agreement,

took it to the House of Commons and was defeated three times and eventually she resigned as

Prime Minister. Boris Johnson was then elected and he came in promising that he had a different

oven ready deal so he'd spent the previous three years rubbishing Theresa May's deal

and then produced his new deal whose fundamental change was to create a border in the

RSC between Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Now, just before we get into our interview,

Alice, to give us a sense of what you were doing during that period, I think you were

a major leading voice which you and the campaign to remain for a second referendum.

I was within the campaign for a second referendum, yes, I wish I'd been more of a major

voice in the referendum on the big question to leave because I think like a lot of people

I didn't think it was going to happen. But Michel Barney is a very, very interesting guy.

I had a bit to do with him during that period because I think we were trying, he records

a meeting in his book that's just come out called My Secret Brexit Diary, now out in English

at polity press and the, you know, he records a meeting with Tony Blair where Tony Blair

was saying that, you know, he thinks there is an opportunity for a second referendum on

the final deal. And of course, that's all history now. But what is absolutely extraordinary

about Barney's book is, I mean, God, as you know, I keep a diary and there were times

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