customers don't quite behave that way right they don't they're not going to say oh just because you

have conviction about something means they should they should use it right they have a mind of their own

so it's a very difficult thing to do but the ability to have strong opinions that are loosely held

so that can be again you, very challenging because it requires literally

sort of two opposite capabilities, right? The confidence to say, I know that there's something

there's there and yet the humility to know that, okay, you know, the customer doesn't like it,

there's something wrong that needs to be changed. I think that's an important part as well.

My name is Beirud Sheth.

I'm the founder and CEO of Dukh.

This is Code Story, a podcast bringing you interviews with tech visionaries

who share in the critical moments of what it takes to change in industry and build and lead a team that has your back.

I'm your host, Noah Laparte, and today how BeRoot Chef built the messaging platforms for enterprises to connect with their consumers.

All this and more on Code Story.

Beirut Sheff grew up in Mumbai, India, and attended undergrad in Bombay.

For graduate school, he came to the States to study at

MIT and then did a short stint in Wall Street before moving into the entrepreneurial world.

He lives in the Bay Area and enjoys hiking, working out, and spending time with his family. He loves

the Bay Area for these things, but also because of the community of ideation.

The way he puts it, someone is always doing something interesting, and he really enjoys that.

Besides business books, he leans towards reading biographies and books about the history of tech and business.

Previously, he founded Elance, which is now Upwork, pioneering online freelancing.

And 12 or so years ago, he noticed a key insight in that the mobile revolution was happening

...