The Abundance Doctrine (with Mike Konczal)

Pitchfork Economics with Nick Hanauer

Civic Ventures

Business, Government, News, Politics

4.8 • 1.5K Ratings

🗓️ 22 April 2025

⏱️ 41 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

What does “abundance” actually mean—and who is it really for? In this episode, Goldy and Paul welcome back economic policy expert Mike Konczal to unpack the big new idea dominating political discourse: abundance. They dive into the buzz around Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson’s book “Abundance,” and Konczal’s sharp critique of its deregulatory leanings, missed opportunities, and neoliberal undertones. From housing policy to green energy to the myth that deregulation alone can fix America’s problems, this episode challenges the idea that more is always better, and asks what it would really take to build a future that’s abundant for everyone—not just the rich. Mike Konczal is the Senior Director of Policy and Research at the Economic Security Project, where he oversees policy development, research, and strategic analysis to advance its ideas. Previously, he served as a Special Assistant to President Biden for Economic Policy and Chief Economist for the National Economic Council. Social Media: @mtkonczal.bsky.social @mtkonczal Further reading: Democracy Journal - The Abundance Doctrine Abundance By Ezra Klein & Derek Thompson Why Nothing Works: Who Killed Progress—and How to Bring It Back By Marc Dunkelman NBER Working Paper - Supply constraints do not explain house price and quantity growth across U.S. cities Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer, @civicaction YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Substack: The Pitch

Transcript

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0:00.0	The rising inequality and growing political instability that we see today are the direct result of decades of bad economic theory.
0:11.0	The last five decades of trickle-down economics haven't worked. But what's the alternative?
0:16.0	Middle-out economics is the answer. Because the middle class is the source of growth, not its consequence.
0:23.1	That's right.
0:28.7	This is pitchfork economics with Nick Hanauer, a podcast about how to build the economy from the middle out.
0:36.9	Welcome to the show.
0:42.3	In recent episodes of pitchfork economics,
0:48.3	we're getting an abundance of Paul Constant.
0:51.3	Oh, man.
0:55.1	What?
0:55.7	No, you don't like that intro?
0:59.5	Yeah, it's great to be here, Goldie.
1:02.5	You just make it so fun all the time.
1:05.2	Yeah, I am here in my official role as apologizing for not being Nick Hanauer. And I'm glad to be here.
1:11.2	Oh, not just that.
1:12.2	Though it's good that you issued that apology.
1:15.1	Also, as our resident book reviewer, which you've done for a long time when I first met you at The Stranger.
1:26.8	You were the books editor there. You
1:29.5	have a column in the Seattle Times. Unlike me, you actually read books as opposed to listening
1:36.1	them while walking your dog. Oh, listening to books counts. Goldie. It counts. I agree. As you know,
1:43.7	I'm writing a book as an audio book right now. That is my
1:48.8	approach because that's how I consume books. And it's good to have you here because you actually
	...

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