From New York Times, I'm Michael Bavaro. This is Adali.

Today, if Russia invades Ukraine, it would be the largest and potentially deadliest military

action in Europe since World War II. So why are the US and its European allies so divided

over just how seriously to take the threat? I spoke with my colleague, Moscow Birocheev,

Anton Trojanovsky.

It's Tuesday, February 8th.

Anton, this is really starting to feel like the scariest moment for Europe. Maybe in decades,

talk of a historic potential invasion of Ukraine by Russia and casualty counts that could

reach into the tens of thousands, leaders across Europe are shuttling around the continent,

desperately trying to find a diplomatic solution so there's not an invasion. And so we wanted

to check in with you on exactly where everything stands for all the major players. Russia,

Ukraine, the United States, and Europe. Let's start with Russia and its troop buildup around

Ukraine. What exactly is the state of that at this very moment?

Well, it's very ominous and it's gotten worse since we last spoke. Russia now has more than

a hundred, ten thousand, by some estimates, as many as a hundred, thirty thousand troops

encircling Ukraine on three sides. And the important thing here is not just the number

of troops we're talking about, but the fact that they're on the move, they're getting

closer to the border. A few weeks ago, we saw a lot of equipment positioned in the area

near the border, but not enough personnel to operate all those tanks and artillery systems

and rocket launchers. We're now seeing a lot of those soldiers showing up from all across

the country, being flown in, coming in on long trains. And the latest thing is we're

now seeing these forces that were positioned a hundred miles or more away from the border,

...