Welcome once again to the Conversations That Matter podcast. I'm your host, John Harris,

and we have a good episode for you today. It's a little bit perhaps, I don't want to say discouraging,

because that's not the word to use, but it's certainly, it's a little disheartening to know

that there are denominations that are Christian that are going in directions that are not

positive or good or, frankly, able to conserve Christianity long term.

That's a big concern that I have, and it's the reason this podcast exists.

And we're going to talk about one of those denominations today, the evangelical free church

in the United States, even the EFCA.

And to do that, I have two guests with me.

I know Jeff's been on the podcast before, but we have Jeff Clear and we also have David

Whitney, who are both.

And I wish I could say that you were still with the EFCA, but you're now former ministers,

former EFCA ministers, I suppose, still ministering, still pastoring.

And both your churches, this makes it easy, are called Cornerstone.

Of course, you've just renamed yours, Pastor Whitney, to Cornerstone Free Church. So you're in

Maryland. Jeff, I know you're just below me. I'm in New York and you're down there in New Jersey

and both of you being faithful to the Word of God, but you've both been essentially kicked out

of the

denomination and defrocked. And so I want to give you both a chance to tell your side of things.

And really with the intent of helping people in the denomination who will see this, understand

what's going on. Because I'm sure if they ask questions, they're going to get a certain narrative

from those in charge.

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