Lawfare Archive: The Spymasters with Chris Whipple
The Lawfare Podcast
The Lawfare Institute
4.7 • 6.2K Ratings
🗓️ 26 April 2025
⏱️ 54 minutes
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Summary
From September 16, 2020: What is the proper relationship between the CIA director and the president? How should directors handle arguably illegal orders? How important is the director's role as the nation's honest broker of information during times of crisis?
To get at these questions, David Priess sat down with Chris Whipple, a documentary filmmaker, journalist and the author of two books about the people around the president. "The Gatekeepers," based upon his documentary of the same name, examines White House chiefs of staff, and his new book, "The Spymasters: How the CIA Directors Shape History and the Future," is based on the Showtime documentary "The Spymasters: CIA in the Crosshairs," for which Whipple was the writer and executive producer. They talked about CIA directors through the last several decades and how they've impacted U.S. history and national security.
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | The following podcast contains advertising. |
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| 0:11.5 | patreon.com slash lawfare. That's patreon.com slash lawfare. |
| 0:18.2 | Also, check out Lawfare's other podcast offerings. Rational Security, Chatter, |
| 0:25.2 | Lawfare No Bull, and The Aftermath. The Easter break may be over, but rollback rolls on at |
| 0:34.4 | ASDA. Like a 12-pack strawberry, Actamel yoghurt drinks, With thousands of prices roll back across the store and online. That's Asda Price. |
| 0:55.9 | Selected stores online subject to availability, |
| 0:57.5 | Actimal and Dunkers 1030th of April. |
| 0:59.2 | May exclude Asda Express and small stores. |
| 1:00.8 | See asda.com slash more stores. |
| 1:21.4 | Online charges may apply. I'm Carolyn Corna, intern at Lawfare, with an episode from the Lawfare Archive for April 26, 2025. |
| 1:28.5 | Since President Donald Trump nominated John Ratcliffe to be director of the Central Intelligence Agency, Ratcliffe has reportedly shown a, quote, unprecedented level of interest in support for Trump's agenda, |
| 1:34.4 | speaking publicly on platforms from Fox News to social media about his efforts to align the CIA |
| 1:39.9 | with Trump's ambitions. For today's archive episode, I selected an episode from September 16th, |
| 1:46.6 | 2020, in which David Priest sat down with Chris Whipple to discuss his book, The Spymasters, |
| 1:52.6 | how the CIA directors shape history and the future. They talked about the proper relationship |
| 1:57.7 | between the CIA director and the president, how directors should handle |
| 2:01.7 | arguably illegal orders, and how CIA directors through the last several decades have |
| 2:06.7 | impacted U.S. history and national security. |
| 2:16.0 | I'm David Priest, and this is the Lawfare Podcast, September 16th, 2020. |
| 2:23.0 | What is the proper relationship between the CIA director and the president? |
| 2:28.5 | How should directors handle arguably illegal orders? |
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