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Welcome to Rationally Speaking, the podcast where we explore the borderlands between reason and nonsense.

I'm your host, Julia Galef, and my guest today is Jason Collins.

Jason is an economist based in Sydney.

He's the leader of the data science team for a financial services regulator, and blogs atason collins dot blog which is one of my new favorite blogs it's got very in-depth and interesting book reviews

of books in all sorts of areas of economics and commentary on different aspects of the important

debates in behavioral economics and evolutionary economics and related fields. So Jason, I'm excited to have you on rationally speaking finally.

Yeah, really pleased to join you. I'm a big fan of the podcast. Oh, yay. So first off, one thing I wanted to ask you is whether you consider yourself a behavioral economist, which, I mean, not that it matters that much, it's just a label.

But, you know, I'm curious whether the criticisms you are likely going to make in this podcast

of behavioral economics are coming from an insider or an outsider. It just kind of changes the tone.

I think I'll call myself an insider, because deep down down I am a big fan of behavioral economics.

It's just a case of, I think, that behavioral economics, or probably, as I prefer to call it a lot

of the time, behavioral science could be so much more.

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