Hey, deserve a listener. There's a lot of you know that I recently published an episode in which I interviewed a minor-attracted person, a non-offending minor-attracted person, or a no-map, N-O-M-A-P, named Jay.

He wanted to be on the show to spread the word that not all minor-attracted individuals are offenders.

It was a pretty interesting interview. It went into a lot of different areas. His own traumas, his kind of thing.

And one of the listeners out there, Paula, actually, listed to the episode and said, hey, I have a colleague who is someone who specializes in treating sex offenders.

And so you should have her on the podcast. So that's how you're on the podcast, Casey. Welcome.

I thank you.

You're a licensed professional counselor, which is master's-level clinician. You also have another credential, which is a sex offender treatment professional.

Tell us about how you gain that credential.

Yeah, so after I got my master's, I worked a lot with like children and things like that, and people who had been abused by individuals.

And throughout like working with the system and learning about that, I learned that people in the system also have high trauma histories.

And I was interested in working in the field of more forensic work anyways. So I kind of looked into that and decided to do a lot more training.

We have to work an extra 1,500 hours with individuals who have been charged or convicted of sexual offenses or have problematic sexual behavior.

So again, not somebody who like actually offends, but is thinking about it, and then a lot more training.

So that's that credentialing outside of the LPC and supervised. I'm guessing by another SOTP.

Yes, supervised as well. It is like becoming something that more people are interested in. So that's nice.

Why do you think that is? Why do you think people are more interested in it?

I think because there's more education around individuals who have committed sexual offenses, that we see that treatment and therapy is actually a huge boost for helping not helping people not recidivate.

And I think they ate people are like, oh, they're like the less of the stigma and things like that.

And they're actually able to use like clinical skills and less punitive measures.

And it's not a one-size-fits-all kind of thing.

So I think there's more clinicians interested in.

Not only recidivation, but also committing a crime in the first place, right?

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