What does godly leadership look like, and when should we submit to our spiritual leaders,

and when should we oppose them? Hi, I'm Julie Roy's, founder of the Roy's report. And due to the

scandal at Daystar TV, this has become a hot topic of conversation. Two weeks ago, I recorded a podcast with author and

pastor Lance Ford on the heretical submission beliefs of Jimmy Evans and Joni Lamb, and that

podcast has received more than 150,000 views. And I heard from numerous people how helpful that

podcast was. Many are recognizing, for example, that pummeling Jonathan

and Susie Lamb with admonitions to submit over 100 times in a single meeting is spiritually abusive.

And many reached out to me saying how harmed they've been by this teaching in the church.

At the same time, I think many are wondering, well, what is the model of

leadership? What should it look like? And this is why I'm so excited that Lance Ford has prepared

this teaching you're about to hear on leadership. Because as Lance explains, the kingdom of heaven is not

like the kingdom of this world. And often what's purported as spiritual leadership

is really spiritual abuse. Now, the irony of spiritual abuse via authority in the church is that the

ones that most often are rebellious are not the ones opposing those who claim to hold the authority.

It's the ones exercising authority in the way of the Gentiles.

They are the ones that are in rebellion to Jesus.

It's an amazing irony.

So this is a bit of a departure from our usual format at the Roy's report.

But I really feel like we're at this teachable moment in the church.

So many of us are sensing that something is profoundly wrong with the way that leadership is being exercised in the church.

But because there's so little true biblical teaching on leadership in the church, we don't know what the way forward is.

And so I'm so grateful to Lance for preparing this teaching that really looks to Jesus as our

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