This is Jonathan Lehman.

This is Mark Devere.

And welcome to this episode of Nine Marks Pastors Talk.

Nine Marks exists to help pastors build healthy churches learn more at nine marks.org.

Is this really going to teach them how to build healthy churches?

Or we're more presenting a negative example?

Some of both.

Go and don't do likewise.

Okay.

There it is.

The moral of this conversation.

Here it is.

Now, we at nine marks don't typically go viral.

We're more like the tortoise.

You know, we hope that eventually will get to the right place.

Come on.

Now, the tortoise seems a little speedy compared to us.

It might even be that.

Let's just be honest. But several weeks ago, for about two or three days in our little corner of the world, a few comments that you made at a conference went kind of sort of viral.

You can't hear it in my head is hanging a bit right now.

Yeah, that's right.

And I see it and testify to it.

...