Hey, Upgrade listeners.

We're taking a break this week, and instead we're bringing you a recast from 2018.

It's called How Psychedelics Can Expand Your Consciousness with Michael Pollan.

You remember that guy.

He wrote, in defense of food and the omnivores dilemma, and now he's on drugs.

It's pretty great.

So please enjoy, and we'll see you next week.

Hello and welcome to The Upgrade, the podcast from the team at LifeHacker, where we help you improve your life one week at a time.

I'm Melissa Kirsch, editor-in-chief of LifeHacker. And I'm Alice Bradley, Lifehacker's deputy editor. And today we're talking about

psychedelics with Michael Pollan. For over 30 years, Michael has been writing about the intersection

of nature and culture. He may best be known as the guy who summed up his principles for

eating thusly.

Eat food, not too much, mostly plants.

He is the author of several books, including In Defense of Food, the Omnivore's Dilemma, and the Botany of Desire.

His latest book is How to Change Your Mind, what the new science of psychedelics teaches us about consciousness, dying,

addiction, depression, and transcendence.

Welcome, Michael.

My pleasure.

As a journalist and author, you've covered food and our relationships with the things that we consume.

What got you started on exploring psychedelics?

Well, long before I was writing about food, I was writing about nature and our engagement

with the natural world and specifically how nature changes us and how we change nature.

...